Peercoin Transaction Speed

I love peer coin and its been great for me in the past with speculation,

my main concern is transaction SPEED, I just got a heap of Earth Coin they claim less than 30 seconds, 10-15 seconds maybe

Can this be done for Peer coin also?, because that’s the final piece for the puzzle for peer coin to take on Visa, Pay Pal and Master card, the banks,

I think you might misunderstand what Peercoin is designed to do. It doesn’t have the same purpose as say Bitcoin or Litecoin, which are used for day to day transactions. Peercoin is designed to be more of a long-term store of value, similar to a savings account.

It’s more secure from attack, more sustainable in the long-term and will have a more stable price later on due to the higher transaction fee discouraging lots of buying and selling. It even has the accompanying 1% interest a year.

This is why we state that Peercoin is NOT and altcoin. It’s trying to achieve different goals from the rest. Read this article, which explains Peercoin in much more detail…

http://cointrader.org/peercoin-proof-of-stake-and-bitcoin/

SPEED is overblown by some alt coin creators. In reality the transaction is announced on the network immediately and that’s the real speed in bitcoin or any other coin; therefore a peercoin transaction which has already been broadcast to the network cannot be reversed. It just takes at least 1 block to confirm the transaction. Confirmation means that a transaction has been processed by the network and is highly unlikely to be reversed, obviously the more confirmations it has the better.

For shopping on the web 10 minutes or even an hour for the required confirmations is seldom a problem. Issue is only when in e.g. supermarket or other physical shop also called Point-of-sale transactions.

That’s where the payment processors come in. Personally I don’t think even the fastest coin can properly compete with them as the current blockchain is not designed for that. Maybe a second generation blockchain which allows for high speed volume transactional processing would change that in the future.

[quote=“Cybnate, post:4, topic:2001”]For shopping on the web 10 minutes or even an hour for the required confirmations is seldom a problem. Issue is only when in e.g. supermarket or other physical shop also called Point-of-sale transactions.

That’s where the payment processors come in. Personally I don’t think even the fastest coin can properly compete with them as the current blockchain is not designed for that. Maybe a second generation blockchain which allows for high speed volume transactional processing would change that in the future.[/quote]
Again the transaction is valid as soon as it is publicly announced on all nodes (seconds), confirmation prevents double spending and credits the new coin holder. When you are using a credit card you run the card through, get authorization and you are done but the merchant does not get credited till few hours later, you just don’t see it. So the transaction at the Point of sale should be comparable to the CC transaction, you walk up, scan their QR code, type in the amount press send and you are done (transactions gets announced and shows as incoming in their wallet).

[quote=“sahkan, post:5, topic:2001”][quote=“Cybnate, post:4, topic:2001”]For shopping on the web 10 minutes or even an hour for the required confirmations is seldom a problem. Issue is only when in e.g. supermarket or other physical shop also called Point-of-sale transactions.

That’s where the payment processors come in. Personally I don’t think even the fastest coin can properly compete with them as the current blockchain is not designed for that. Maybe a second generation blockchain which allows for high speed volume transactional processing would change that in the future.[/quote]
Again the transaction is valid as soon as it is publicly announced on all nodes (seconds), confirmation prevents double spending and credits the new coin holder. When you are using a credit card you run the card through, get authorization and you are done but the merchant does not get credited till few hours later, you just don’t see it. So the transaction at the Point of sale should be comparable to the CC transaction, you walk up, scan their QR code, type in the amount press send and you are done (transactions gets announced and shows as incoming in their wallet).[/quote]
For transactions up to 10 PPC (say US$60) I agree with you. The risks for the retailer are relatively low. For larger point-of-sale transactions (especially those high volume ones without face-to-face) retailers would fall-back on payments processors (or creditcards) as they would guarantee the payments.

how safe is 0 confirm of btc vs ppc ?

So I am glad you asked the question! I think you will be surprise to find out that Peercoin is safer!

So here is a scenario on bitcoin network with a user trying to double spend:

Let’s say you have a wallet with 0.055BTC and you want to acquire something that costs .05 but you want to try and double spend so in essence you buy the item with 0 confirms but keep the bitcoins.

  1. Step 1 you initiate a transaction to the merchant for 0.05BTC and ZERO fee, the transactions gets announced within seconds and the merchant sees the incoming transaction & you get the item.
  2. Step 2 you immediately send the 0.05BTC to your other wallet but this time you PAY the 0.005 fee
  3. Now both transactions are announced with 2 different timestamps but it will be up to the miners which transaction will be included in the block, therefore there is a chance that the 0 fee transaction gets ignored and the fee transaction gets included.
  4. If the fee transaction got included in the ledger (block) your initial transaction gets dropped and the merchant is out of your BTC!

And now let’s look at the peercoin with 0.51PPC in your wallet:

  1. Step 1 you initiate a transaction to the merchant for 0.5PPC and 0.01 mandatory fee, the transactions gets announced within seconds and the merchant sees the incoming transaction & you get the item.
  2. Step 2 you immediately send the 0.05PPC to your other wallet and again you PAY the 0.01 fee
  3. Now both transactions are announced with 2 different timestamps but since the miners do not care about the fee the transactions get included by the timestamp and your second transaction (double spend) gets dropped.
  4. Merchant got the coins, you got the item & an empty wallet but the network kept you honest! :wink:

And your other risk would be of course a hard fork, when all of a sudden we have 2 blockchains and one ends up being dropped (the one that had your transaction), we had that happen once, I believe last year when some clients got upgraded and some didn’t on the BTC network. Have not seen that happen on peercoin.

[quote=“Cybnate, post:6, topic:2001”][quote=“sahkan, post:5, topic:2001”][quote=“Cybnate, post:4, topic:2001”]For shopping on the web 10 minutes or even an hour for the required confirmations is seldom a problem. Issue is only when in e.g. supermarket or other physical shop also called Point-of-sale transactions.

That’s where the payment processors come in. Personally I don’t think even the fastest coin can properly compete with them as the current blockchain is not designed for that. Maybe a second generation blockchain which allows for high speed volume transactional processing would change that in the future.[/quote]
Again the transaction is valid as soon as it is publicly announced on all nodes (seconds), confirmation prevents double spending and credits the new coin holder. When you are using a credit card you run the card through, get authorization and you are done but the merchant does not get credited till few hours later, you just don’t see it. So the transaction at the Point of sale should be comparable to the CC transaction, you walk up, scan their QR code, type in the amount press send and you are done (transactions gets announced and shows as incoming in their wallet).[/quote]
For transactions up to 10 PPC (say US$60) I agree with you. The risks for the retailer are relatively low. For larger point-of-sale transactions (especially those high volume ones without face-to-face) retailers would fall-back on payments processors (or creditcards) as they would guarantee the payments.[/quote]
When you are talking high value items the sales people kill so much of your time that in the end waiting 10 minutes for 1 confirmation would not matter as I was never able to buy any cars under 10 minutes…

[quote=“Derek Pater, post:1, topic:2001”]I love peer coin and its been great for me in the past with speculation,

my main concern is transaction SPEED, I just got a heap of Earth Coin they claim less than 30 seconds, 10-15 seconds maybe

Can this be done for Peer coin also?, because that’s the final piece for the puzzle for peer coin to take on Visa, Pay Pal and Master card, the banks,[/quote]

[1] Speed on block chain tech is an illusion, as the faster you go, the more confirmations you need,

[2] PeerCoin is not aimed at low value retail craptastic plastic, depreciating assets, but high value appreciating assets, big sore of value.

Eg PeerCoin goes for currency swaps, backbone currency, houses, balancing the nightly,

thanks. never thought of that.

Thanks sakhan, your post opened my eyes about security on Peercoin confirmations. Very interesting, and possibly something to use in future marketing. This is a positive side of fee destruction.

Agree with cars, but I was more referring to high value items without the face-to-face. E.g. larger grocery items, presents, etc. via websites (think Thanksgiving, birthdays, Christmas etc.)
With you post on peercoin safety, it might be safe for retailers to ‘risk’ higher value transactions with Peercoins.

Wouldn’t the following be fantastic on a retailers website:
Direct Bitcoin payments up to 0.1BTC (say US$80)
Direct Peercoin payments up to 150 PPC (say US$1000)
Forget about payments processors for a second, Peercoin should start providing a payment framework for retailers, it would save them the cost of payments processors and they might be able to compete with that and get the true value of a distributed network. Maybe I’m going too fast, but I think it is a good vision on where to go to in the future.

I agree, the only issue here is liquidity of peercoin to any given fiat currency. BitPay & Coinbase can both leverage their coins & dollars vs several exchanges. The only realistic peercoin exchange for the moment is BTC-E (volume wise) but current volume does not support price stability. You can buy a million dollar house with BTC and it will move the price by less than 1%, the same buy on peercoin would move it by 10% or more. I am sure this will come with time but we are not there yet.