Open transactions

ppcman, you might be right. Sometimes I tend to live in a world that is determined by seeing things through rose-coloured glasses, a world that is infused with enlightenment (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_is_Enlightenment%3F). In that world it would be no problem to determine the real advances, to find the valuable thoughts.
But the reality seems to be different.
I finally come to the conclusion that I share your reservation about advertizing Peershares too early.

Should I remove the post?

EDIT: Hmm, is it really that explosive material? To explosive even for peercointalk? I was thinking that I was more like summing up what everybody already knows.

:-[

I didn’t find it “explosive,” just passionate and well-reasoned – I see no need to worry about it, or consider removing it.

[quote=“pillow, post:22, topic:2002”]Should I remove the post?

EDIT: Hmm, is it really that explosive material? To explosive even for peercointalk? I was thinking that I was more like summing up what everybody already knows.

:-[[/quote]

I’m deeply sorry if one of my posts made you consider removing your post!
I find it extraordinarily interesting and by no means explosive.
Indeed you summed things up what everybody else knows - or could know. But you put it in words that had some weight.
I like controversial topics - what helps more to find out how the world is?

You could find worse places than peercointalk.org for starting discussions like this one!
Based on my experience so far it is a place where people treat others with respect, try to be helpful, are understanding, intelligent and rather argue for their position than simply claim that their position is the right one.
Please continue - we can stand it :wink:

No you shouldn’t. You could write another page point to out potential problems so people who see the opportunity also see the uncertainties and risks.

pillow, your post is fine. My comments were a little tongue-in-cheek at best. Just leave it. Just don’t rant it on reddit or bitcointalk. Leave that stuff here. :slight_smile:

[quote=“masterOfDisaster, post:24, topic:2002”]I’m deeply sorry if one of my posts made you consider removing your post!
I find it extraordinarily interesting and by no means explosive.[/quote]

I wanted all your peoples input to make and informed decision whether to remove or not. I’ve decided not to. Thanks for your kind words.

Good point. And for sure, I’m only detailing what I think could be one possible outcome. I think in terms of odds and possible futures. There are many and the one above only one of the ones I find more likely (and appealing).

Great! :smiley: Just wanted to be sure I’m not breaking windows and ruining stuff here. For sure I am only a peercoin n00b newly registered and did not know that Peershares even existed that long ago (weeks?). I think your points are valid. Perhaps a year ago I would not have agreed, but looking at the explosion of new coins and what not, pump n dump most of them… Since things are already well financed, why not build up the infrastructure to and get a head start. I think you are so right ppcman! Thanks for pointing this out to me!

Just wanted to thank you for your contribution (and signing up for this thread). Your ‘rant’ was a good and interesting read and I’m still digesting bits of it. I think it is good to reveal slowly bits and pieces of what is to come. Given the complexity it is easy to overwhelm people with information on a launch. Slowly educating and repeating messages, fine-tune, discuss and then building around that is a good strategy to get complex messages across and understood by the wider community.

Open Transactions Voting Pools Justus Ranvier Crypto Valley

I read in the chat box that Ben talked briefly to Chris Odom about Peercoin/Open Transactions integration. We’ll need to port BTCD to work with Peercoin, but once that is done, it’s a fairly minor effort to enable the API methods that OT uses.

Someone with knowledge of the programming language “Go” could help with this.

It’s time for a peer4commit project or perhaps a bounty thread now… right?

[quote=“pillow, post:30, topic:2002”]I read in the chat box that Ben talked briefly to Chris Odom about Peercoin/Open Transactions integration. We’ll need to port BTCD to work with Peercoin, but once that is done, it’s a fairly minor effort to enable the API methods that OT uses.

Someone with knowledge of the programming language “Go” could help with this.

It’s time for a peer4commit project or perhaps a bounty thread now… right?[/quote]

Yes, I agree that this is something that we should be actively promoting. Having our own fork of btcd would make a lot of different things possible, beyond setting us up for an integration with OT.

[quote=“Ben, post:31, topic:2002”][quote=“pillow, post:30, topic:2002”]I read in the chat box that Ben talked briefly to Chris Odom about Peercoin/Open Transactions integration. We’ll need to port BTCD to work with Peercoin, but once that is done, it’s a fairly minor effort to enable the API methods that OT uses.

Someone with knowledge of the programming language “Go” could help with this.

It’s time for a peer4commit project or perhaps a bounty thread now… right?[/quote]

Yes, I agree that this is something that we should be actively promoting. Having our own fork of btcd would make a lot of different things possible, beyond setting us up for an integration with OT.[/quote]

I’ve been pushing for OT here on Peercoins, from the first post when I registered here (the reason for registering).

[ul][li]I see great value in technology, because it is a very complementary technology. The technology is not wide spread - yet. I often read about banks eyeing things like Ripple. But once they hear about OT, I’m very confident that they will change their mind, because OT is superior to the needs of bank.[/li]
[li]If Peercoin is there for the start, its a clear mark that “Peercoin community” knows what its doing.[/li]
[li]We would have first mover advantage (second only to Bitcoin) and would get free publicity in media. When people talk about OT they would say, there is already support for Bitcoin and Peercoin.[/li]
[li]…and much more.[/li][/ul]

The only reason I’ve not created a peer4commit project already and made myself captain, is that I simply don’t have what it takes. I’ve got some peercoins dedicated for it though.

Ever dreamed of a cheap, trust-less, lightweight, p2p exchange? OT is your friend. Do you want the transactions to be untraceable? OT is your friend. Yup that’s right… no need for BlackCoin, DarkCoin and all of that. No point putting features like that into the coin and make it suspect in the eyes of regulators.

Oh-man… we need this.

@pillow, you could start a peer4commit project kickstarter like style. Say you know you would need 2000 PPC to attract a developer, you would just try to raise that and request return address from every donor. If you can’t find a developer to do the job for the funds raised within say 3 months the funds are returned to the donors.

Happy to help out setting it up, but I can only drive so many projects at a time myself. So do need another captain :wink:

[quote=“pillow, post:32, topic:2002”][quote=“Ben, post:31, topic:2002”][quote=“pillow, post:30, topic:2002”]I read in the chat box that Ben talked briefly to Chris Odom about Peercoin/Open Transactions integration. We’ll need to port BTCD to work with Peercoin, but once that is done, it’s a fairly minor effort to enable the API methods that OT uses.

Someone with knowledge of the programming language “Go” could help with this.

It’s time for a peer4commit project or perhaps a bounty thread now… right?[/quote]

Yes, I agree that this is something that we should be actively promoting. Having our own fork of btcd would make a lot of different things possible, beyond setting us up for an integration with OT.[/quote]

I’ve been pushing for OT here on Peercoins, from the first post when I registered here (the reason for registering).

[ul][li]I see great value in technology, because it is a very complementary technology. The technology is not wide spread - yet. I often read about banks eyeing things like Ripple. But once they hear about OT, I’m very confident that they will change their mind, because OT is superior to the needs of bank.[/li]
[li]If Peercoin is there for the start, its a clear mark that “Peercoin community” knows what its doing.[/li]
[li]We would have first mover advantage (second only to Bitcoin) and would get free publicity in media. When people talk about OT they would say, there is already support for Bitcoin and Peercoin.[/li]
[li]…and much more.[/li][/ul]

The only reason I’ve not created a peer4commit project already and made myself captain, is that I simply don’t have what it takes. I’ve got some peercoins dedicated for it though.

Ever dreamed of a cheap, trust-less, lightweight, p2p exchange? OT is your friend. Do you want the transactions to be untraceable? OT is your friend. Yup that’s right… no need for BlackCoin, DarkCoin and all of that. No point putting features like that into the coin and make it suspect in the eyes of regulators.

Oh-man… we need this.[/quote]

  1. Does OT have a fiat entrance?

2)when will OT available? I hate their website not mentioning any time line. Shall I wait to 2019?

I don’t know if they have it yet. Its an open source / open system, so people can add servers to the network. The issuer of the fiat derivative/contract is also a third-party risk. Exchange between crypto coins/assets works much better (less third-party risk / no need for trust), because of multsig and voting pools. If they don’t have it yet, they will have it in the future. I don’t know and I’m only speculating, but a bank would be perfect here (because on you want them to be regulated and be able to take legal action).

Its already used in a game, but I don’t know what their milestones/roadmap looks like.

[quote=“Cybnate, post:33, topic:2002”]@pillow, you could start a peer4commit project kickstarter like style. Say you know you would need 2000 PPC to attract a developer, you would just try to raise that and request return address from every donor. If you can’t find a developer to do the job for the funds raised within say 3 months the funds are returned to the donors.

Happy to help out setting it up, but I can only drive so many projects at a time myself. So do need another captain ;)[/quote]

I’m not sure that I will be able to calculate the cost. :’(

Ripple has Multisign work in progress, once it will be ready I’d suggest to concentrate on Ripple Multisig(voting pool) Gateway.

I wasn’t aware of this. Very interesting.

EDIT:
Just read this: http://coinjoint.info/navajo-suffers-double-spend-attack/
And then we have the VeriCoin thing.
I bring this up just because it proves my point why we need decentralized p2p exchanges such as Open Transactions (or if Ripple can do something similar)!

I don’t know if they have it yet. Its an open source / open system, so people can add servers to the network. The issuer of the fiat derivative/contract is also a third-party risk. Exchange between crypto coins/assets works much better (less third-party risk / no need for trust), because of multsig and voting pools. If they don’t have it yet, they will have it in the future. I don’t know and I’m only speculating, but a bank would be perfect here (because on you want them to be regulated and be able to take legal action).

Its already used in a game, but I don’t know what their milestones/roadmap looks like.[/quote]

http://cryptogeeks.com/peercoin-introduction-open-transactions-ot-chris-odom

summer or fall, OT will be ready.

I’ve been in contact with OT. They said the following:

[ul][li]Wallet side the Go developers have not yet defined the protocol that is needed for Peercoin wallet support.[/li]
[li]OT is using btcd for backend.[/li]
[li]OT will add additional calls (JSON-RPC over websockets) to btcdwallet for voting-pools.[/li][/ul]

btcd is an alternative full node Bitcoin implementation written in Go (golang). Porting it to Peercoin would be a good thing, but lot of work. It would be good in the sense that it contributes to the open source and decentralized nature of Peercoin. It would require a lot of work, because it would have to be maintained to match any protocol changes in Peercoin core (let’s call it core).

Another way of doing it, is to add websockets to Peercoin core to support JSON-RPC.

More details about the calls:
http://opentransactions.org/wiki/index.php?title=Voting_Pool_Deposit_Process

Voting Pools white-paper start:
http://opentransactions.org/wiki/index.php?title=Voting_Pools

OT will inform me once the additional calls are defined.