The NuBits project needs people/entities with substantial funds available to them to conduct automated exchange operations on an ongoing basis. No capital gains or losses are possible within the scope of the needed trading activity. Your funds will not be passed to anyone working on the NuBits project. You will need to deposit funds in your own account at an exchange and run a trading bot we will provide. Your principle risk will be exchange default. You will be compensated a negotiated rate for this risk. You will not be in a position to fill this role unless your net worth is well into the six figures USD or higher. Full details about the role you may fill and the NuBits project itself will be given to qualified candidates. Persons/entities that fill this role will be eligible to purchase shares of our venture immediately.
Could the exchange itself put up the funds? This would mitigate the default risk.
I would be surprised if a lot of the exchanges are actually that liquid. They may have “lots” of money laying around but in most cases it isn’t theirs.
I’m curious why you don’t just seek traditional venture capital… or better yet, just start crowdfunding through Peershares? Granting trading access to a bot seems nearly equivalent to handing over cash anyway. Even if no one from NuBits can directly transfer money to or from the account, the account value could still be completely depleted through disadvantaged trading. This isn’t even a question of trusting the NuBit’s team… an unforeseen bug or external interference with the bot’s instructions could have rapid, irreversible consequences. Why do you want to expose yourself to such liability when you could place all the risk on investors through a proper prospectus?
We are seeking other parallel avenues for liquidity, but isn’t it appropriate to bring it up with the Peercoin community, where many of us were introduced to cryptos, to see if anyone is interested?
Any financial deal is a risk. We’re confident we are doing everything we can to minimize the existential risks, but “shit can go wrong,” regardless of the microscope it is put under, so do your own due diligence and ask for details if you think you have the ability to assist our endevour.
OK, I understand the need to limit disclosure of full details at this time. I just thought I’d ask questions publicly in case there were obvious answers I was missing. I hope I didn’t come across as argumentative or hostile - I wish the NuBits team all the best!
No, your question was a valid one. My response was probably more emotional than it needed to be. I feel strongly about what we’ve built, and what we’re continuing to build. Skepticism is a good thing. I hope that as information is released that it will show the value proposition of the product that we’ve envisioned and built.
We will make the trading bot open source at the same time we release full project details to the public so there won’t be any mystery about how it functions.
I would like to know more. Most likely I will want to participate to help your team and hopefully to learn something new also. When you say my “principle risk will be exchange default” I don’t really understand what you mean, could you elaborate on this risk a bit more please? Also, is there a minimum amount of PPC needed to participate?
Please, feel free to PM me if you are more comfortable with communicating privately. All information that you send me privately and that I have not heard elsewhere publicly, I will hold as secret and in confidence with you.
I don’t have that much money under my name but I’m just curious. It’s conceivable to make a closed trading system that funds put into it will not get lost (it’s all number games anyway). But why need that much money then? Why not injecting some virtual fund? If the system has to interact with external financial world so it needs real money to really test it, then I wonder if the risk is only limited in exchange default (for that you want to have an exchange that has been fully audited.)
I am just thinking aloud so you don’t have to answer me in any specific way. I’m posting because I assume potential team members may have the same questions. Feel free to say, “If anyone has this question please contact us for the answer”.
Can you please let us know when you’ve found the necessary people to carry out these tasks so I can stop advertising?
The nature of financial investment is that risk is commensurate with reward. It’s a basic tenant of investing. NuBits is a very highly speculative venture to be sure, and the corresponding potential impact and profit aligns with that.
This particular aspect of our system however does not have capital gains and losses risk, only exchange default risk, as stated by Jordan above. Part of the difficulty in explaining this is that NuBits’ design is unique and novel, and represents a new way of thinking about cryptocurrencies. The purpose of our trading bot is quite different than what is commonly expected of existing trading bots.
So, the nature of the design of our trading bot and NuBits system means that your scenario of an “unforeseen bug or external interference” is not likely.
In regards to seeking traditional venture capital; Jordan is in a better position to answer, but my understanding is that we are aiming for as decentralized a system as possible. Aligning ourselves with VC would compromise that goal. We also are not conducting an IPO, which rules out Peershares.
The nature of this position requires a high amount of liquid assets for reasons that will become apparent when our final design is released.[/quote]
This makes it much more clear. So it’s something specifically related to NuBits and how it functions.
It seems that the following is true:
[ul][li]The money never leaves the exchange.[/li]
[li]The money has no risk of capital loss through trading.[/li][/ul]
If these are both true, then the exchange could just “create” the money on their books. Why must it exist, if it cannot be withdrawn or lost?
Can Jordan please address learnmore’s question? I’d also like to understand why you are soliciting high net-worth individuals to make this happen. Couldn’t the same thing be accomplished with crowd funding? Why does the financial status of the investors matter if they understand they are putting funds at risk, like buying shares of stock or Peercoin for example?
If you are setting this up as an investment partnership (ie. hedge fund), then having accredited investors make sense. In the US, however, this requires an individual net worth in excess of seven figures ($1M+), not including personal residence. Investors can also meet the standard if annual income exceeds $200k for a period of at least 2 years.
I think this is what they are looking for. Joining at this stage requires the commitment and trust of a full “team member” rather than merely an investor. Jordan is convinced that there is no risk of capital loss through trading, but he is limited as to what he can disclose outside of the “team.” The money required to make the relationship worthwhile is substantial. Perhaps Jordan’s statement about “net worth well into the six figures” is a bit misleading and should be increased by an additional “figure.”
All in all, this looks like a legitimte opportunity for someone of significant wealth who is already familiar with the ideas behind cryptocurrency and could quickly develop a working relationship with the rest of the NuBits team. It’s likely such a person may be better located through this board than through traditional Wall Street soliciting. Also Ben points out that this could be viewed as a show of gratitude to the Peercoin community… albeit for 1% who can afford it!
I have a feeling there will be more opprortunites for the rest of us announced through this board in the future…
I hope. I was looking forward to buying some shares, but I don’t have 6 figures.
My favorite game on Christmas, is guessing what’s inside the packages before unwrapping them. My own or others, it doesn’t matter. Let’s play the game with NuBits
What do we know? The goal is to limit volatility. Exchange bots, has something to do with it. And they need money, lot’s of money.
Volatility is when price goes up or down. An exchange is where you can deposit, buy, sell and withdraw currencies. Bots trading operates through the API and can poll some data and also buy and sell currencies, etc. Since Jordan Lee says that coins will not leave clients accounts, we know that the bots will not withdraw any money. A qualified guess, is that bots will not deposit coins either. I think the bots will use the money to buy and sell coins.
Volatility is when price goes up or down and since reducing volatility is about pushing down price when it goes up, and push it up when it goes down, I guess that has to do something with the bots buying and selling. Perhaps if price goes up, bots could sell. If price goes down, bots could buy. This would create a trading channel in which the price bounces around.
The bots could also communicate with each other. Even if they don’t withdraw or deposit any coins, they could send messages to each other on the back-end (the server running the bots), saying things like: “Hey, I’m gonna buy at X and sell at X and what are you gonna do?” And the other bots will be like, “Hey, cool, then maybe I’ll buy this and I’ll buy that.” By doings so, a bot could be selling coins to another bot, knowing that it is the other bot on the other side. This could be used to “paint the ticker tape” (manipulating price into certain patterns).
The bots, together, would have to have a great deal of the market share, to be able to manipulate the market in such a fashion. Is this why Jordan Lee asks for wealthy participation?
Most likely I’m totally wrong about this, because this kind of “shared stabilization fund” could be exploitable and other bots front running the operations which means that there would be capital losses, which the NuBits team says is impossible.
Well, enough of me speculating. I honestly have no clue what NuBits will do, but it’s so exciting I couldn’t help playing a game of “whats in the box”
Let’s play a guessing game. I am not sure the Jordan likes our doing this in public at this point. So I wrote down my guess of the nature of nubits and why such team members are needed, signed it with my ID, and hashed the guess text at http://www.xorbin.com/tools/sha256-hash-calculator
This is the ourput 86dcf8ee866dca8c34284048a0f6de3ede274f46e4d9f4fe88a61b6ad79ae7c3.
When nubits is public I will reveal the guess. Everyone can check if the revealed contents is what I hashed today.
Anyone else wants to play? ;D
I hope. I was looking forward to buying some shares, but I don’t have 6 figures.[/quote]
Same here, and there is a difference between having it and having it readily available.
My best guess is that this is more about insurance than market making given the near zero risk statement. I’ll refrain from further guessing here.